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Bardock Discussion

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Bardock Discussion

Post by MysticFog on Thu Oct 08, 2009 10:09 am

Originally posted by Dizlord on June 6, 2008


Introduction, Bardock:

Okay time to fully introduce this character, i couldn't be arsed to do this before but i will do so now.

Bardock had amazing combos in SBAR, with alot of damage, i saw a vid of hahaderick who made a 4000+ damage combo which is kinda impressive. Anyhow in this game such high damage combos ain't possible from what i figure but Bardock sure still has some damaging combos.

Bardock was always a character that had a semi to high fanbase, hence why he's in the game and not, let's say Burter or #19, well let's see if he is a justified character in this game.

---------------

Now pros and cons about Bardock:

Pros:

-> Bardock has incredible variations in his combos
-> Bardock is an excellent Mid/Close Range Fighter
-> His Heat Phalanx nullifies Mega Crush
-> His Heat Phalanx also be be used for a SRJ setup
-> after a grab, Bardock is able to land a full SRJ on the enemy, you'll think twice to turtle a skilled Bardock player when you recieve 1150dmg just because of that.
-> Bardocks SRJ is almost instant, making it possible to connect it in nearly any situation

Cons:

-> Bardock is inferior to High Range Fighters for example Piccolo
-> Bardock has no transformations which could be a disadvantage in a multiple rounds fight.

---------------

Let's move on with some in game mechanics.

Slam Starters:

>SS* -> His Mid Range starter, Bardock jumps and delivers a kick
followed by a high knee.

SSE- -> This is a Close Range starter, with a semi Axe kick and 2
punches to the gut followed by a ki-cancel.

<SE- -> Another Close Ranger starter, 2 punches to the gut followed
by a ki-cancel.

Note: Never use SSE- and <SE- in the same combo, because as soon as you deliver the third punch to the gut the opponent will be send in the so called "low Juggle" state which makes it impossible to continue the combo at all. All thre starters can be combod into Heavy Smash.

Well counting 3 starters with one beeing 3 hits is pretty decent for now. Lets move onto sum Rush attacks that are comboable:

Rush Attacks:

RS -> a Simple 2 hit combo where at the end the enemy is
slammed to the ground with no hope of breakfall, thus
leaving the opportunity to use Riot Javelin on him.

RRS -> a 3 punch combo that launches the enemy into the air
leaving the opportunity for a Riot Javelin at the end of this.
You can also use a ki-cancel at the end of it and hit an
Ultimate while he's still launched(only works with Super Riot
Javelin)

RRRS -> this combo is probably the most variable one of the Rush
Attacks, you can cancel it while charging at S or you just
finnish the combo there with either heat Phalanx or Riot
Javelin. You can also Heavy Smash into it or if you ki-cancel
fast enough even hit an Ultimate.(Super Riot Javelin only)

<RR -> This 2 kick combo does stun at the first hit everywhere, the
second just stuns in air. This also is comboable with Heavy
Smash.

>RRR -> This combo launches a bit at the end meanign if you're
quick enough you can finnish this with a Riot Javelin.

<RRS -> This 3 hit combo ends wit ha pretty high launch. Leaving the
opportunity for a super or an Ultimate if ki-canceled.

>RRRS -> This 4 hit combo ends with a little launch, leaving little
opportunity for a Riot Javelin or even a Super Riot Javelin

>>RR(S) -> This combo stuns after the R but also smacks the opponent
on the ground at S, nice string to continue or finish a
combo

Okay these Rush attacks look pretty nice seeing you can end them or continue them or even use them for an ultimate.

---------------

Strategy:

Well seeing as Bardock should never ever try to engage a High-Range Fight it's best for him to stick with Mid/close Range Fights.

->Enemy on Mid/Full ki:
If you want to be aggressive you can go for Rush downs such as RRS or RRRS as a counter when you TCed without attack or for offensive purpose. In a close situation i would not try to use >SS, you can get of guard there pretty quick with 1 ki blast if you're unlucky. For a quick 2 hit combo i'd recomend <SS up close because SS is a little too slow.
If you want to be a little less aggressive you can wait for oppenings especially with Super Spammers, stay in Mid- Range use >SS* and RRRS>E or RRRS<E. Due to the launch of RRRS>E it can't be megacrushed. and with Heat Phalanx nullifieing Mega Crush you should be save

->Enemy on Low ki:
Well if you're close enough, maybe due to an offensive TC you should use SSE- as a combo starter. If you're about 2-3 character lengths away use >SS and start some combos.

->Enemy Turtles:
Well don't bother trying to find a Guardbreaking Slamstarter, Bardock has none.
What you can do is this:
If by any chance the enemy just turtles even if he turtles in UG. Bardock has a method of breaking that down in an instant. You just have to get close enough then you grab the opponent and fire a SRJ Right back at them for 1150dmg, if they are at full ki if not it's even over 1200dmg. They will think twice if they will continue the turtle strategy.

->Enemy is aggressive:
Don't try to outfasten the enemy if they are aggressive especially at the beginning of a round. Bardocks Slams aren't made for that except for <S*. Then if they try to rush you down you just guard or UG if necessary soon they will try to hit a charged slam or a Grab, if that's the case do a sidestep and start rushing them down, probably they will waste some ki on MC, then it's your turn to act, as soon as they drop a bar of ki get aggressive, try >SS*, or even >SSS if necessary, cause that's a quick combo, they'll either eat the damage or waste even more ki on MC which is just nullified. If you continue that they might be left with 0 ki and then you have to get the oppening fast for alot of damage.

->You have low Ki:
This goes for pretty much any character on low Ki, but you might not know this so i better write it down before you're completly clueless.
First of all you should prevent to get below 1 Ki bar, that leaves you open for a great amount of damage.
Let's say you get into this situation somehow, then you should prevent at all costs to be hit with a starter or hit in general. If you ain't close backdash some more...add a sidestep or 2 and you should be atleast at 1 ki bar again. If you by anychance are too close you better get ready to guard and sidestep at the moment someone tries to charge a Slam Start or if you see a HS incoming, keep your eyes a bit on the ki bars if you can't detect it by motion.

---------------

Strategy against the AI:

The AI can be a bitch at higher levels, well not for Bardock. Seriously Bardock is one character that can Exploit the AI so good even a "noob" can win against let's say a level 6-7 AI with ease.

How you do that you might ask, well it's rather simple if you wanna play it cheap.

All you have to do is spam Heat Phalanx over and over and over again.

Yes that's right. Spam it, the AI will UG and therefore lose KI. Sometimes the AI will try to interupt. If the AI uses Heavy Smash, you just laugh...because HP goes right trough it.

Slam attacks are a bit more of a problem if they do it quickly...if they hit you either wait for a Rush string and MC or do a TC.

Rush attacks are easily countered with MC.

After you counter either of their attacks just spam Heat Phalanx again, because they will try to attack from range, but HP just has a very long time to to fully stop. So even if you see the attack just haveing a little smoke in the air it still does damage and has a kick back effect.

I have tested this against the Tien, Yamcha and Trunks AI...with the same result every time...an easy win...effortless if you ask me.

This is for everyone who struggles with the AI on higher levels. I hope this helps you abit with the AI on the levels from 5-8.

---------------

Fatigue Management/Combo Breaks in general/for Bardock:

This is a very important aspect I somehow didn't add because it is kinda difficult to manage a low fatigue with Bardock.
Bardock has a problem to keep his fatigue low. Why? The answer is easy, he has no transformation whatsoever, so you can't by any chance spam Teleport Counters(TCs). TCs are bad bad bad bad bad if you spam them they deal alot of fatigue to yourself...that is not what you want, because if you have a too high fatigue you're open for a free ultimate and you can kiss 1 bar of health goodbye.
So how to solve this problem...well if possible dodge attacks by pressing guard this will add just a bit fatigue instead of a great amount like TC.
If you can't dodge somehow you might have to resort to a Mega Crush it doesen't add fatigue but you lose a ki bar, but be warned, you need to know if the opponents string is a Slam or a Rush one. Mega Crush will NOT work on someone who uses a slam string when you activate it.
Be Sure you activate MC when he uses a rush string...well how do i know ? Easy a rush string usually is alot longer than a slam string and has more quick than powerfull attacks. You can only escape Slams when you TC and if you MC during a Slam you just wasted 1 ki bar.
If your fatigue is above 60-70% you should activate AuraSpark cause it will reduce your fatigue aslong as you're in it. AS gives more benefits than just that but you will see that in Bardocks stats.

Okay i know that's alot of shit i wrote there. Here is the short version:

-Don't spam TC....use dodge instead
-use MC to break rush combos easy without adding fatigue but losing 1 ki bar
-you can only escape Slams with a TC
-AS to get your fatigue down. You can also use Ultimate Guard to reduce fatigue
-AGAIN DON'T SPAM TC THIS WILL KILL YOU QUICKER THAN YOU THINK

Okay i hope this will help people out with keeping their fatigue down. If it's by any chance not working what I posted feel free to tell me.

---------------

Fighting with Bardock:

Well it doesen't really matter if you fight on the ground or in the air since most Bardock combos work equally in the air as on the ground.
RRS and RRRS are great Rushstrings attacks both trackable and with RRS leading to a little launch wich can be continued with Riot Javelin. and RRRS even leaving the opportunity to cancel and start a combo with. This is probably a great start for a round especially when your opponent is a little close and wants to start a Rushstring aswell.
Bardocks Slam starters are a bit Slow so i suggest you only use them at about 2-3 character lengths away from the opponent. You should be save with this >SSE-, SS
from Mega Crush anyhow, seeing as you can at about any moment of the combo use a Heavy Smash in addition that Heat Phalanx nullifies MegaCrush aswell it's probably a good choice, just remember, even if MegaCrush won't stop your Heat Phalanx the opponent can move again after MegaCrush, so don't charge it up.

---------------

Bardock Movelist:

-> Heat Phalanx
Heat Phalanx is probably the best move after a Heavy Smash attack, because it nullifies Mega Crush. I wouldn't charge it rather use the EX version(R2 + <E) for additional damage. This move is a bit too slow but fullfills it's purpose. After HP you can either use RJ or even SRJ, great combo Super.
Rating: 9.0/10

-> Riot Javelin
A great move to finish a launch attack, it's very fast in it's execution. The damage is pretty medicore, Without charge it only hits once, leaving only 1 chance to TC, in EX it has 3 hits. This move is so fast that you can hit the enemy even in the lowest juggle without any chance of breakfall, he can even hit a juggled person with a HS and still execute RJ for full damage, that's how fast this move is.
Rating: 9.5/10

-> Super Riot Javelin
This Ultimate does a little less than 1000dmg, which makes it inferior to Spirits of the Sayans, but this move is incredible fast, you can combo it into launches, even the lowest launches can end with SRJ. You can also combo it into stuns and even after HP leaving a variation that is really incredible.
Rating: 9.5/10

-> Spirits of The Sayans
The most powerfull move of bardock, does about 1100+ damage, but it's fairly slow, it can only be comboed into 1 launch and into no stun, because it takes up alot more time than SRJ.
Rating: 8.0/10

---------------

4 or 5 bars? The Question...no here is the answer.

4 or 5 bars? Yea Bardock has no 3 bars Ultimate, but he doesen't really need it since he has no transformations he needs to achive quickly.

I guess i get to the point here quickly because to me the choice is obvious, here goes:

At first i thought SRJ which is the Ult for this bar setup is inferior to SoTS, but it's not. You saw the Moves list above(atleast i hope you did) and you saw that my rating for SRJ was 9.5 and SoTS only got 8.0. Because of that i won't go into detail but it gives the 4 bars setup an advantage, but lets start with the 5 bar setup.

->5 bars
Yea this is it 5 bars, are 5 bars to waste ki with, like for MC, TC and so on. Despite it might be a disadvantage to reach maximum for AS because there is 1 more bar to fill, the ki regen in this game is kinda fast and 1 bar won't make much of a difference. Then again bardock only has a avrage ki regen, which does make a difference, not much but it does. The main reason this setup should be picked is when you don't want to rely on Ultimates and more on EX moves...you can combo 2 EX moves together and still have 3 bars left. the damage output will be less. The Ult of this setup ain't comboable into most of the launches and stuns, mostly HS and <RRS with the last beeing 1 frame thingy i think which makes it almost impossible to pull it off constantly.

->4 bars
This setup actually plays a little different, yes 1 bar does make a difference, but the Ultimate of this setup does the real difference. While 4 bars ain't much of a change to 5 bars. 4 bars will be the better damage dealer. You get back to full ki faster, which means AS faster which means a significant stats boost with Bardock as you will see later. But the real edge gives the Ultimate of this setup...it is comboable with so many strings i can hardly count them all, the surprise effect is so much bigger than the 5 bars setup that it is actually perfectly clear this setup is the clearly better setup for Bardock.

Conclusion: 4 bars is the best way to go with Bardock, the reasons can be found above.

---------------

Bardock stats:

Normal - full ki :

110% Attack
110% Defence
100% Speed

Aura Spark:

143% Attack
121% Defence
120% Speed


---------------

Okay You've talked for quite abit now what he can do but show us some combos already, you might think. Well here goes, just for you:

Legend:

R = Rush attack
S = Slam attack
> = Towards opponent
< = Away from opponent
/\ = Up on the D-pad
E = Energy Button
- = Cancel
~ = Sidestep Cancel
* = Stun
' = Fully charge upcoming move
HS= R2 + S
AS= AuraSpark
MC= R2 + E
SRJ= Super Riot Javelin
SoTS= Spirit of The Sayans


Basic Combos:

Those combos are easy to do without any Cancel knowledge.


>SS*, <R*, >RRR>E - 7hit 692dmg 10-15% fatigue given

>SS*, <R*, >RRRS>E - 8hits 818dmg 10-15% fatigue given

S*, <R*, >RRR>E - 6 hits 613dmg 10 fatigue given

<RR*, >RRR>E (this one only works in air tho) - 6 hits 583dmg 10% fatigue given

>SS*, <R*, RS>E - 6hits 682dmg 10% fatigue given

>SS*, <R*, RRS>E - 7 hits 696dmg 10-15% fatigue given

>SS*, <R*, RRRS, HS<E 9 hits 951dmg 15% fatigue given

Advanced Combos:

These Combos require knowledge about canceling


>SS*, RRRS-, <RR*, HS<E - 10hits 994dmg 15-20% fatigue given

>SS*, RRRS-, SS*, HS<E - 11hits 1055dmg 15-20% fatigue given

>SS*, RRRS-, AS <RR*, HS<E-/\E - 13hits 1973dmg 40-50% fatigue given (SoTS)

>SS*, RRRS-, AS SS*, HS<E-/\E - 14hits 2050dmg 50% fatigue given (SoTS)

>SS*, RRRS-, <S*, HS<E - 10hits 990dmg 20% fatigue given

Even More Advanced Combos:

These Combos require Cancel/ki-cancel knowledge + perfect timeing.


>SS*, RRRS-, <RR*, HS<E-, RRS>E - 13 hits 1084dmg 20% fatigue given

>SS*, RRRS-, <RR*, HS<E-, RS>E - 12hits 1048dmg 20% fatigue given
Tried the last 2 combos with breakfall on and they are working perfectly.

SSE-, RRRS, HSE~ >SS*, <E - 11hits 1108dmg 20% fatigue given

<SE-, RRRS>E - 7 hits 584dmg 10% fatigue given

SSE-, RRRS-, <RR*, HSE~, >SS*, <E - 13hits 1173dmg 20-30% fatigue given

SSE-, RRRS, HSE~, >SS*, >RRRS>E - 15hits 1318dmg 30% fatigue given

SSE-, RRRS, HSE~, >SS*, <RRS<E - 14hits 1284dmg 30% fatigue given

SSE-, <R, HSE~, RRRS-, >RRRS>E - 14 hits 1272dmg 30% fatigue given

SSE-, >SS*, <RR, HSE~, RRRSE-/\E - 17 hits 1809 dmg (SRJ Ultimate only) 40% fatigue given

SSE-, >SS*, <RR, HSE~, RRRS-, >RRRSE-/\E - 20hits 1874dmg (SRJ Ultimate only) 40-50% fatigue gained

SSE-, >SS*, RRRS, HSE~, <RRS/\E - 17hits 1665dmg (SRJ Ultimate Only) 40% fatigue gained

SSE-, >SS*, RRRS, HSE~, <RRSE-/\E 17hits 2084dmg (SoTS Ultimate Only) 50% fatigue gained

>SS, HSE~, SSE-, RRRS-, >RRRS>E(EX) 17hits 1514dmg 30-40% fatigue gained

>SS, HSE~, SSE-, RRRS-, <RRS<E(EX) 14hits 1535dmg 30-40% fatigue gained

>SS, HSE~, SSE-, AS, RRRS-, RRRS>E(EX) 16hits 1756dmg 30-40% fatigue gained

>SS, HSE~, SSE-, AS, RRRS-, <RRS<E(EX) 14hits 1859dmg 30-40% fatigue gained

>SSE-, SSE-, AS, <RR, HS<E~, RRRS-, >RRRS>E(EX) 19hits 2004dmg 40% fatigue gained

>SSE- SS* >>RRS- AS RRRS- <RRHS <E(EX) /\E 20 hits 2859 dmg (LRJ) (credits to cowboyoni)

>SS*, >>RR, HSE~, SSE-, AS, <R*, RRRS<E(EX)/\E 18hits 2522dmg 55-60% fatigue gained (SRJ Only)

SSE-, <R, HSE~, RRRS-, AS, >SS, >RRRS, HS>E(EX) 18 hits 2142dmg 40% fatigue given

>SS*, >>RR, HSE~, SSE-, AS, <R*, RRRS-, >RRRS, HS>E(EX) 21hits 2217dmg 50% fatigue given

SSE-, AS, >>RR, HS<E~, >SS*, <R*, RRRS<E(EX)/\E 19hits 2797dmg 60% fatigue given

SSE-, AS, >>RR, HS<E~, >SS*, <R*, RRRS-, >RRRSHS>E(EX) 21hits 2397dmg 50% fatigue given.

>SSE- AS SS* >>RRS- <RRHS~ RRRS- \/S >E- >RRRSHS >E(EX) 23 hits 2464 dmg (ground only) about 60-70% fatigue. (credits to cowboyoni)

SSE-, AS, >SS*, RRRS-, <RR, HS<E-, >>RRS/\E 20hits 2137dmg 40% fatigue given
(SRJ only)

>SSE-, AS, SS*, >>RR*, <R*, RRRS, HS<E(EX), >E(EX) 17hits 2305dmg 50% fatigue given

>SSE-, AS, SS*, >>RR*, <R*, RRRS, HS<E/\E 19hits 2643dmg 60% fatigue given(SRJ Ultimate Only)

>SSE-, SSE-, <R*, HSE-, RRRS-, >>RRS-, \/S, AS, >RRRS, HS, >E(EX) 22 hits 2016dmg 40% fatigue given(ground only)

>SSE-, >>RR, HSE~, SSE-, <R*, RRRS-, \/SE-, >RRRS, HS, >E(EX) 22hits 1925dmg
40% fatigue given(ground only)

>SSE-, AS, >>RR*, <RR*, HS<E~, 'SS*, RRRS-, >RRRS, HS>E(EX) 22hits 2473dmg
50% fatigue given.

>SSE-, AS, >>RR*, <RR*, HS<E~, 'SS*, RRRS<E(EX)/\E 20hits 2906dmg 70% fatigue given.(SRJ Ultimate Only)
Note: Damage may vary due to the fact how/when you hit SRJ.

>SSE-, AS, >>RR*, <RR*, HS<E~, 'SS*, RRRS<E(EX), >E(EX) 18hits 2506dmg 50-55% fatigue given
Note: Damage may vary due to the fact how/when you hit RJ.

>SS*, >>RR*, HSE~, 'SS*, <R*, RRRS-, \/SE-, >RRRSHS>E(EX) 22hits 1930dmg 40% fatigue given.

'SSE-, AS, >>RR*, <RR*, HS<E~, >'SS*, RRRS<E(EX)/\E 20hits 2910dmg 70% fatigue given
Note: Damage may vary due to the fact how/when you hit SRJ.

'SS*, >>RR*, HSE~, >'SS*, <R*, RRRS-, \/SE-, >RRRSHS>E(EX) 22hits 1998dmg 45% fatigue given

'SSE-, AS, >>RR*, <RR*, HS<E~, >'SS*, RRRS<E(EX), >E(EX) 18 hits 2572dmg 60% fatigue given
Note: Damage may vary due to the fact how/when you hit RJ.

*New Combos (video included)*

'SS-, >>RR*, <RRHSE~, >'SS, RRRS-, \/SE-, >SSE-/\E (SRJ) 2057dmg
http://youtube.com/watch?v=3n7rEHaT5BE

The Combos out of my Bardock vids i posted:

These Combos are also More Advanced Combos.

SSE-, <R*. RRRS-, AS, >SS*, HS<E-/\E - 15hits 2065 dmg 40% fatigue given (SoTS)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kVtwrqAoeB8

SSE-, <R*, RRSE-, /\E - 11hits 1194dmg 30% fatigue given (SRJ Only)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UX6FzWufqL0

>SS*, RRRS-, SSE-, AS, <RR, HS<E-/\E - 26 hits 2091dmg 50% fatigue given (SoTS)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Euvm-Hdfvhc

>SSE-, SSE-, RRRS-, <RR, HS<E-, >RRRSE-/\E - 20 hits 1771dmg 40% fatigue given (SRJ Only)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KmMn7zCodfE

>SSE-, SSE-, RRRS, HS<E-, <RRSE-/\E - 16 hits 2065dmg 50% fatigue (SoTS only)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bwajbAq9fUM

Note: Bardock can use HS on a juggled person and end it with RJ. Every Combo is done at both players Full ki, am not sure about cowboyonis combos tho.

2008 Dizlord

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